Locked display states?

[Diemaker1]

Is there a way to “lock” a display state?
So you can activate a DS then hide/show parts without fear of messing up drawings.

 

[J-C]

The only thing I can think of is to create another one. Drawing views use the first one by default.

Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[Diemaker1]

it's not just about drawing views... don't people hide parts while working within a DS, then those parts are gone from the DS till explicitly shown? that seems...fragile

I'm just wondering if there IS a way to lock DS and i haven't found it.

 

[smcadman]

The way it was done before display states was to make new configurations. Suppress or unsuppress what you need/don't need for each configuration. This may be what you want to do instead of "locking" display states.

SW06 SP5.0

Flores

 

[J-C]

Still not sure exactly what you're wanting. The parts in the DS don't reshow themselves randonly do they? Perhaps when you add new parts to the assembly, they showup in all DS and you don't want that?

Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[Diemaker1]

I’m talking about setting a DS to display the parts you want to see. Then “lock” that DS so it always displays those parts when activated. You would change the DS by unlocking it.

Right now, it appears DS is dynamic. Whatever is displaying when you leave the DS redefines that DS. Which I think is BS. I want to define a DS and it not change till I tell it too. Especially since it’s controlling assy. prints.

But also just for assy. work. Isn’t DS a good way to control the display for groups of parts? If there is a DS named “top” showing only 20 parts in an assy of 200 parts… and “top” is activated… then you hide 3 parts while doing some work… those 3 parts are now gone from “top”… but I still want “top” to show 20 parts, I just needed to turn off 3 parts to do one thing. In order to add those 3 parts back to “top” I got to hunt them down in the tree and show them.

Understand now?

If that’s the way it works… that’s the way it works. maybe it was easier to program that way, it seems it would be harder to program because DS has to save a list everytime it is exited. Maybe there is a whole different mindset I don’t understand.

I’m not sure how Configs are any different. They are dynamic too. Whatever is displayed when you exit the config is now that config.

 

[J-C]

I see now....you more or less want a temporary way to hide parts then unhide them when you're done. A sort of reverse isolate command. Maybe some options added to the Isolate command to easily turn parts on and off would work. As it is now....you can't add or remove items isloated without exiting the command and reactivating it.

Wonder how they could implement something like this. Does Inventor have something to handle this situation?



Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[Diemaker1]

Maybe I expect DS to be something it isn’t because it’s a little strange to me you don’t see any problem with the way it currently works. I thought DS was a way to group parts for a push button display of those parts. Effectively creating “visual assemblies” that are easy to isolate for continued work… which may require further hiding/showing of parts that have no bearing to what you intend that “visual assembly” to represent.

The big problem is DS are also used to isolate groups of parts in drawings. And that a part that is temporarily or accidentally hid in an assy while in a DS will be removed from the finished print… is crazy.

Like I say, if there is a good reason for DS to change at will I’d like to hear it.

Since you brought it up... in my view IV’s equivalent works perfectly logical.

 

[J-C]

I see dislpay states as an expansion of what configurations are...or rather used to be used for in this context. Just a way to create a visual representation of the assembly or some portion of the assembly. As such, you could create a DS for various groups of parts such that working on that group is easier. You could also create a DS for a drawing view to show only what you want to show in that view.

You may not know, but you can choose to hide components from the drawing view itself instead of using a display state. This was the way you typically did it prior to Display states (though you could do it with configs). Go to the drawing view properties and there is a tab there for hiding parts. This works ok when you want to hide a few parts in the way. I prefer display states (configs before that) to handle isolating a small group in a large assembly.

My biggest issue with display states and hiding directly from the drawing view is when you add new components to the assembly. They automatically show up. There is an option for configurations to hide newly inserted components but it applies to the config, not the DS which means its all or nothing for all displays states under a config. Perhaps this setting should move to the DS level since it pertains to hiding.

All in all..I see your point some. I've heard people request the ability to lock configs so they can't be changed unless you unlock it....perhaps the ability to lock a DS would be handy.

How does it work in IV exactly. I didn't think IV had configs. It has visual reps right which are like DS? Are they separate files?

Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[smcadman]

If you are using Display States to temporarily hide stuff so you can work on it, then it sound like the Isolate command in SW07 is what you are looking for:

http://www.paul-flores.com/isolate_2007.pdf

On as side note, does anyone know how to shrink a PDF file size whenever you use "Save as" PDF in Solidworks? It is a 4Mb file, but the images are small (178kb and smaller). I am using Acrobat 6 standard (not free reader).

SW06 SP5.0

Flores

 

[CorBlimeyLimey]

I haven't tried it yet, but how about using a Design Table to set the "$DISPLAYSTATE" and set the option to "Block model edits that would update the design table".

​

Helpful SW websites faq559-520​

How to find answers ... faq559-1091​

SW2006-SP5 Basic ... No PDM​

 

[Diemaker1]

CBL: I see, a DT can be set up to show the same parts everytime. Yes, that is what I want. It’s quite a bit more work than what I’m used to though.

I see configs as a top level assy manager. It can hide show parts but it’s unique ability is to control mates. To show the same assy in different positions. But it has to rebuild the assy on each config change… right? At least it rebuilds the mates. Once the top level assy is loaded DS is quick and fast way to hide/show groups of parts with out any rebuild period.

I suppose the other unique ability is to un/suppress. If your top level assy is large… then you would want to use configs to divid your assy into workable sections. But then use derived configs with DS

Jason said: “My biggest issue with display states and hiding directly from the drawing view is when you add new components to the assembly.”

Exactly. That’s another reason I want to lock DS. New parts are not added to DS if they are locked. It’s a little hassle to unlock the DS that you do want new parts to show in, that’s why the lock has to be quick and easy to toggle. Right now… you add a block to an assy then that block shows on every assy print using DS is nuts.

I see the option in configs for “hide new components”. It’s buried behind a few picks. That’s why everyone says SW needs more picks. It’s great SW has all these options but some options get used more than others. Your not going to change that setting on configs everytime you add a part. …Now, what would be nice… Control pick 5 configs, RMB and hit “unlock”… new part is added to those unlocked configs. Add mates, then RMB on the config header and select “lock all”.

Well, everyone wants what they want, right? I guess the answer to my original question is… NO. I’ll just have to be real real careful.

 

[J-C]

Unfortunately the design table can no longer be used to control hide/show of components. It only controls which Display State is active for that config. Which brings up another issue with DS. For drawing views, you can teel them which DS to use.....but when using the assy in another assy....it always uses the active DS.

Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[Diemaker1]

“.....but when using the assy in another assy....it always uses the active DS.”

You’re right, that’s not good. DS should not control what an assy is… way too many levels of confusion. DS should just control how it’s displayed while being worked on.

How does IV work? The default View Rep is “none”. Which actually means “all” because there are no display modifiers, everything in that assy is shown. That’s how DS should work. SW can even do a little better because their default view can be “ALL” (none confused everyone, hehe). And the only DS available when inserting a sub is “ALL”.

That way, Configs and DS are completely separate controls. Configs controls what an assy is. DS only controls part display of a config that is open and active.

And BOTH configs and DS should have a lock.

 

[CorBlimeyLimey]

Enhancement Request.

​

Helpful SW websites faq559-520​

How to find answers ... faq559-1091​

SW2006-SP5 Basic ... No PDM​

 

[J-C]

In fact, if you go to submit an enhancement and choose "Configurations/Other".....you get a list of common enhancements....one being Ability to lock a configuration in a part or assembly from modification


Actually, when I think about, the current options (Suppress new features, Hide new components, suppress new components) is very much like locking it. Problem is 1. Its not easy to see which configs have which options set, 2. Its not easy to change those settings for multiple configs. Easy way to handle this is to do something similar to the Display Pane for the feature tree that you can toggle or flyout with 3 columns for these settings. Then you could see them and change them easily. Also, the "Hide new components" probably should be removed from the configuration level and put under the Display States level.

Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[Diemaker1]

I can’t believe I’m the first to see this as a problem.

Those 3 Advanced Options only apply to new parts. They don’t “lock” the config. Anything you change while in the config still changes that config. All those options look like individual enhancement request band-aids, close to overlapping in function and confusing. Lock/unlock could replace them all and much more.

I’d rather see the config and DS icons change to show locked-unlock. With mult-select and RMB control.

 

[J-C]

I see what you're saying....and agree it would be helpful at times to lock them down. Not sure about the best way to implement it...maybe a default "All" display state for each config would be good with derived DS for doing groups of DS. Tree would complicated (already is) with all the nested configs and Display states.

In IV....when you hide a part while in a visual rep....it doesn't "remember it" like swx ....so that activating it again puts it back? Is there a special command to adjust the visiblity of components?



Jason

UG NX2.02.2 on Win2000 SP3
SolidWorks 2006 SP5.0 on WinXP SP2

 

[Diemaker1]

I also don’t know all the ramifications configs and states deal with. I can see how locking configs could get messy. But DS just looks unfinished.

You know Jason, I’m trying to avoid using the “I” word. There’s no I in Solidworks…

Oh, wait, I guess there is.

 

[smcadman]

"Maybe I expect DS to be something it isn’t..."
"I can’t believe I’m the first to see this as a problem."
"And BOTH configs and DS should have a lock"

Maybe it has to do with discipline. I haven't had any trouble with Display States because I use DS for visual purposes on assemblies, and on drawings I use configurations. You can use DS on your drawing views, but the hidden items will show up in your BOM. With configurations, the suppressed items do not show up.

I think that if you have used multiple MCAD programs, you will find that each program has it's pros and cons. I've read some of the Inventor forums, and many times users will complain that Solidworks does this and Inventor makes it harder to do that. You just have to learn how to use the program your company has, and if it can't do it, then you have to find a way to fudge it.

The good thing is that if enough users feel a need for "locks" on display states or configurations, then SW will add it in the future.

SW06 SP5.0

Flores