Version Comparisons 1

[jwillison]

Edgers,

We are currently using SE V11. We have had a good year so far, so we have the budgetary opportunity to upgrade (we haven't had a maintenance contract since 9/11). In the past, whenever we upgraded to the latest version we always ran into problems that took a few service packs to sort out. With that in mind we are considering between upgrading to V12 for now or holding off a bit for V14.

So: what were the improvements of V12 over V11? From what I've heard they were mainly in the web publishing side and that we are not involved in. What are the improvements of V14 over V12 (and V11)? Should we just skip V12?

Thanks in advance.

 

[swertel]

v12 over v11
v12 has many vast improvement in drafting and speed. They also reorganized the file data structure so draft files are smaller in size. If you use Insight, that has been beafed up in v12. Creating reference (construction) planes is quicker. Draft allows new cross sections. The sketch view is now in the same graphics window, with the option to turn it off. Smart dimension now performs its original function as well as similar function to distance between command. More functionality in Express Route. You can create stitch welds. Translators have been enhanced.

v14 over v12
Obviously, v14 maintains all the improvements that v12 has over v11, and also the following.

Surfacing Surfacing Surfacing: blue dot, blue surf, better surface loft (more robust). Tear off a sketch. Edit variable (equations) when placing dimensions. New Ribbon bar look. Move the EdgeBar to the left. Move Status bar above graphics area. Angle Ordinate dimensions. New Intellisketch points: silhouette, quadrant, and pierce. Surface inspections: curvature comb and zebra stripes. Enhanced curve features. File backups. Dynamic editing. Insight improvements: Life Cycle assistant. Reference plane normal to curve, anywhere on the curve. CAM Mates. Systems Library command. Cylical interpart copies and mates. Using sketches to mate to in assemblies. Better use of assembly sketches. Broken out section views in draft. Smaller assembly files. Faster draft view creation and update. Make parts reference in draft views. Broken views. Dimensions in ISO views. Improved translators.

I know this is just a long confusing list. If anything strikes you as interesting, let me know and I'll elaborate. v14 SP2 seems to take care of the show stopping issues for my company. We've been running it since the service pack came out... no problems. I would recommend skipping v12 and going straight to v14. There are still some annoyance problems that other users have experienced, but they don't stop you from meeting your deadlines. Those should be addressed in SP3 due out some time in July.

--Scott

 

[jwillison]

Hi swertel

Thanks for the reply. I think I have a pretty good idea on most of these improvements but I would appreciate if you elaborated on the following:

- Systems Library command
- Cyclical interpart copies and mates

Thanks again, it sounds like we should wait 'til July and get V14 SP3.

PS. Any word on a macro command being added?

 

[swertel]

Systems Library:

This is an assembly level command. Basically, Systems Library is to assemblies as feature library is to parts and symbol library is to drafts. A lot of companies' products contain the same parts and mounting features outside the scope of configurations/Family of Assemblies. Each of these parts is used as a group, but not as a subassembly in the BOM or manufacturing. Basically, Systems library allows you to create these groups as seperate files and insert them into your assemblies. You not only group the parts together in a sort of subassembly, but you also attach part features that are common to the group. These features will then be added to the mating parts already in the assembly. This is a really cool feature for some organizations that have component reusability designed in.


Cylical Relationships:

This is when you create a part in place, but then need to mate it to another part but get the error: "This will create a circular dependency." That error should be going away. There is still some mating relationships that will cause this, but they have diminished. The main power of this new ability is to be able to create interpart copies between parts.

For example, you used to control the hole locations in Part A from Part B. So part B was intercopied into A. If you had some geometry in Part A that you would like to control Part B with, you couldn't because B was already interparted into A. Now, you can make an interpart copy of A into B and still make an interpart copy of B into A.

FYI:
V11 and v14 allow multiversioning. In other words, you can install both on the same computer, although with a little effort. If you can get a copy of v14 with SP2, load it up and test it out.

Also, it seems that you are not getting the best bang for your buck if you have to pay full price for a license of v14 if you have v11. If you did have the maintanence, you can essentially get 4 years of upgrades (and SP's) for the price of one full seat of Edge.

In other words, Edge costs ~$5000 US. Maintanence ~$1200 US. 1200*4years=4800. You may want to revisit having a maintanence agreement. Not to mention the technical support and newsgroup access. Eng-tips is great, but there is more traffic on the newsgroups and EDS employees answer there also.

 

[Pekelder]

I found every new version of SE is a big improvement (been using is since v1.0), but we have the policy to await at least sp3 before upgrading (we even skipped V11..). I understand you need beta testers, but as a company of five, we've no time for that ;-)

I fully agree with swertel, the EDS newsgroup and technical support is good, and well worth it. Bargain EDS for a new upgrade for a price under the price for a new version. They don't have to put the sales effort in you!

Regards,

Pekelder

 

[jwillison]

I agree that the EDS newsgroups are useful. When we had the maintenance contract I used to be fairly active in them. We've been using SE since V7 here, it's just that past experience has led us to be leery of upgrading right away (that tended to make us feel like beta testers of a released version, which isn't right). I only have a limited opportunity for this budgetary approval so the question I had was do I upgrade to V14 (which was only released a couple of months ago) or only upgrade to V12 (which has presumably had most of the kinks removed).

Another thought that just occurred to me: any problems with converting files from V11 to V14? We probably also have some older version files lying around here. I should take the time to do a batch update I suppose but...

With SP3 coming out in July or so, we can probably feel pretty safe in upgrading to V14 now. And yes, I will push for the maintenance contract.

 

[swertel]

I think every CAD user/manager is leary of upgrading right away. It seems to be the state of the industry to release a buggy product at a predeteremined market schedule rather than when the product is ready to ship. Sadly, your 3SP rule (which I tend to follow also) only works because of the users that can afford (I use that term lightly) to upgrade right away and work out these bugs.

We are also a small company in terms of CAD deployment. We can't afford the downtime beta testing new software. This was the first try at doing a multiversion installation. I have to say, this works very nicely having the two versions on your computer. The old version for all production work. The new version for testing during "free time." My free time was basically recreating some parts in that I did in the old version that I thought would be a suitable test in the new. As a matter of fact, I was able to create a part in v14 that I had to fake in the draft view of v12 and before.

JWillison, it seems you already made your decision to wait for v14. One more point to make you feel more comfortable about your choice. I started with v10. The upgrade to v11 was interesting, not because of Insight, but because other than Insight, v11 focused on bug fixes. YEAH! I could have lived without v12 other than they fixed a few bugs in it that were not going to be addressed in v11 service packs. We did have work arounds for those, though, so it really didn't matter. There were no features in v12 worth upgrading to, for me that is. I was actually excited about the upgrade to v14 because of the new features. So far, running on SP2, I am very pleased with it! v14 hasn't rolled out through-out the entire company yet; some big projects to finish first, so I don't have a lot of feedback from other users yet.

--Scott