IP / Copyright / License - linguistic complexity / 1st sale doctrine

[etxxx]

I bought a used copy of Autodesk Inventor 11. It is 3 versions older than that newest one. Since I was able to retrieve the name it was first registered, I got past their Activation Code stage (2nd layer of protectionism). Than in Help>About, I see this:

License Expiration: xxxxxxxxx
License Behavior: Permanent

I check Autodesk's licensing document at this link:
docs.autodesk.com/ACD/2011/
ENU/pdfs/adsk_lic.pdf

Under the License behaviors section (page 7 of 62), it says:

Permanent Allows permanent use of an Autodesk product.


However, under the Definitions of license parameters section (page 20 of 62), it says:

Parameter: Expiration Date
Definition: Amount of the time the licenses are available
Example: PERMANENT


Question:
1. How can a permanent license has an expiration date? If there is an expiration date, should it not be called a permanent license?

2. What kind of double standard is this? Is this magical linguistic twist a product of some Ivy-Leagued (or better) lawyers?

3. Since when do you get to define on a contract something to be different than conventionally accepted wisdom? In this case, a PERMANENT license has an EXPIRATION DATE.


I believe Q(3) has broad and deep implications, as many people like myself has been scammed into buying a PERMANENT license that will EXPIRE. Should I turn around and sell my properties PERMANENTLY and get them back after the EXPIRATION DATE (I will put this on the sale contract)? This is the only way I can think of to make up for my loss in the Autodesk scam. Will I win in court in the (obviously) ensuing a legal battles?


********************
PS: I also posted this question on Yahoo Answers.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/i...CI0BggkjzKIX;_ylv=3?qid=20110730184858AAiJlrM

 

[Ron]

3. Since when do you get to define on a contract something to be different than conventionally accepted wisdom? In this case, a PERMANENT license has an EXPIRATION DATE.

Contracts are full of clauses other than conventionally accepted wisdom....happens every day.

A contract doesn't have to be fair, it doesn't have to be morally right, it doesn't have to be anything...except legal....and you can bet that software producers such as Autodesk have some of the better intellectual property lawyers in the world on their payroll. They rarely, if ever, lose a copyright or licensing issue.

 

[etxxx]

Extra info:
When I requested the activation code with name under which my Inventor copy was registered, I was given 1 that causes the license to expire in 13 months. However, I know a guy who is able to activate his AutoCAD 2010 and there is no EXPIRATION date.

--> Could this be because he activates a never registered copy? Or is it because he activates a version that is not 3 versions older than the current version? In that case, it would be wise to retain that activation code he is having now.


Does anyone know anything about it?

 

[etxxx]

@ Ron:
Yes, it is sometimes necessary to define on a contract term(s) to be DIFFERENT meaning than conventionally accepted wisdom. Professionals use words differently than laymen.

However, a to sell your PERMANENT license (defined to allow permanent use of a product on the contract) with an EXPIRATION date seems to fall into the category of FRAUD to me.

 

[Ron]

Not if either is appropriately defined in the document or references.

 

[IRstuff]

I think you misread a less than crystal clear passage in the document.

I think that what they meant to say is that all licenses are formatted with an expiration date field, but some have no expiration date, and have an entry in the field that represents PERMANENT.

This is not terrifically different than the less than intuitive approach used in some password expiration fields, wherein you enter, say, 90 days, i.e., you have to change your password every 90 days, but an entry of 0 means that you never have to change your password.

In any case, it's not a contract thing, it's a programmer thing.

TTFN

FAQ731-376
Chinese prisoner wins Nobel Peace Prize

 

[etxxx]

hey RSstuff,
my copy of Inventor does specify an EXPIRATION date, which I replace with the xxxxxx. The License behavior is PERMANENT. This is why I say it is a double standard. I know a guy who has AutoCAD 2010 with NONE in the EXPIRATION date field. This is mentioned in a post above.

 

[MacGyverS2000]

FYI... AutoCAD does not recognize transfer of licenses. They were sued a few years back, initially lost, but then won on appeal. Legally speaking, you have an illegal copy of an AutoDesk product.

Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com

 

[etxxx]

FYI... I robbed it from its previous owner after paying an agreed sum. It was a recorded transaction which took place in a country that signed the Free Trade Agreement of North America. The fact that Autodesk is not happy with me robbing the copy of the software after paying for it does not make the acquiring of the software illegal.

 

[patprimmer]

I think it does make it illegal, at least in the USA, it just does not make it immoral or unethical or unjust.

Regards
Pat
See FAQ731-376 for tips on use of eng-tips by professional engineers &

http://eng-tips.com/market.cfm

for site rules

 

[TheTick]

First Sale Doctrine only covers the actualy copy of the copyrighted material. Congratulations, you bought a copy og bits and bytes.

Autodesk has absolutely no obligation to make it run, any more than Random House has any obligation to teach you to read.

 

[MintJulep]

Even the slightest bit of research before hand would have shown you that at best getting your second-hand copy of AutoCad up and running would be difficult.

Even the slightest bit of research before hand would have shown you that AutoDesk is vehemently opposed to supporting second-hand sales, and has sufficiently deep pockets to fight opposing decisions in court, and has a history of prosecuting illegal copies.

So even the slightest bit of research before hand would have shown you that buying a second-hand copy of AutoCad is risky at best.

But you didn't do and research before did you?

So you wasted your money.

Now you come here whining and crying about things you couldn't be bothered with before you pissed your money away. Don't expect any sympathy.

Don't go away angry, just go away.

 

[MacGyverS2000]

FYI... I robbed it from its previous owner after paying an agreed sum. It was a recorded transaction which took place in a country that signed the Free Trade Agreement of North America. The fact that Autodesk is not happy with me robbing the copy of the software after paying for it does not make the acquiring of the software illegal.

Your lack of agreement with my statement does not change the facts of the matter... AutoDesk, via the license agreement, does not allow for transfer of licenses. You have essentially paid a sum of money for a CD, but the data on it still belongs to AutoCAD (much to my chagrin, but so far US law is backing them). If you purchased it in a country which does not recognize AutoDesk's license agreement (and AutoDesk does not sell their products in countries which do not recognize their EULA), you have obtained that copy illegally, and the seller has likely broken a law or two themselves by selling it to someone in an export-restricted nation.

You will not find anyone here willing to help you get around AutoDesk's EULA... and I'm sure you can figure out what to do with your pissy attitude.

Dan - Owner

http://www.Hi-TecDesigns.com